wspollack
Well-known member
Perhaps some of you have read my post about riding from my home in the Albany, NY, area to visit family in Asheville, NC ... and of course to do some riding in that area. See https://www.bmw-scooters.com/index.php?threads/400-at-the-gap-aka-tail-of-the-dragon-last-week.3132/
That was an eight-day trip in the end of May, beginning of June. I had originally planned that for about two weeks earlier, but the day before I was going to leave I discovered that the rear tire pressure was about 15psi too low. I hadn't ridden the C 400 GT in about two weeks (I was goofing off on my other bike, a Meteor 350), and just sort of hoped, deluded myself, etc., into thinking this might be a fluke. Or maybe a very tiny leak -- say, 1psi per day -- and I could certainly deal with that.
So, the rear tire aired up, I started out the next morning. I got about 100 miles from home, and decided to get gas and check the rear pressure. It was down to around 20psi or so. I forget the exact pressure, but in any case I was certainly not dealing with a loss of 1psi per day. I realized that despite any wishful thinking, this was not acceptable, so I pumped up the tire, got off the NY Thruway, turned around, and headed for home on lesser roads. I stopped a couple of times to top off the air, as I was losing air at about the same rate.
A few days later, after making an appointment at Max BMW in Troy, NY -- they squeezed me in, because I sort of begged them -- I pumped up the rear tire a bunch and then some, rode the bike to Troy, and got a new rear tire installed. I didn't ask them to check the old tire, because I wasn't really interested in it, and neither were they: the service dept. rep told me that they don't patch tires, they just put new ones on (a typical liability stance, the same one taken by my car dealership, for that matter).
That was on May 22. On May 28, I head south again.
I kept a careful eye on the rear pressure, in case there was a problem with the rim or something. Such checking was easy, because I have a FOBO TPMS sensor back there. (I also have a digital gauge with me, because those asshat engineers at BMW, with their sideways "spoke" placement of the Schrader valves preclude the use of an external TPMS sensor on the front wheel, as it would smack into a brake-disc caliper; the rear, with only one disc, is okay. And don't get me started on the C 400 Grand Tourer's lack of a built-in TPMS, unlike most -- all? -- of the other Beemers.)
I checked that rear pressure each morning, and it was perfect, no change. This was after doing roughtly 500 miles the first day, 400 the next -- I was then in Asheville -- and 400 the next (doing the twisties down there). And then, after three days of real visiting, roughly 400 miles the first day on the way home, and getting as far as about 300 miles on the second and final day home. Perfect every morning. I have the screen grabs of the FOBO readout to prove it. And each time I also checked that the sensor was on there nice and tight: no movement at all.
That second day on the return trip should've been roughly 400 miles, but that was not to be. At 300 miles that day, As I was pulling into a rest area on the NY Thruway (this time headed north, obviously) to get gas, I thought the bike felt a little funny, in the handling department.
I also thought maybe I was imagining things. In any case, I got my gas, and slowly rode past the pumps, along a bit of the way toward the on-ramp. But those few yards convinced me that the bike was definitely squirrelly. So I turned around, parked, and checked the pressure ... which was 0.
So I put the bike on the centerstand, sat down on the ground -- it was 87°F, by the way -- and slowly and carefully rotated the tire. I was looking for a nail, that sort of thing, but didn't find anything. I tried to pump up the tire, but didn't get anywhere: it wasn't holding air.
So I called BMW Roadside Assistance (which is included during the warranty period). I didn't get anywhere with them, either: after a little more than two hours of phone and text communication, they said that I was on my own, make my own arrangements, they couldn't provide assistance at my location, and I would be reimbursed. That's an on-going story, and I just filed my claim paperwork a few days ago (and haven't heard back yet).
After that, I called AMA, for which I also pay for assistance, based on my auto-renewing. They could get me a tow to a multi-line, non-BMW, motorcycle shop in Mahwah, NJ -- not all that far away -- but not before it would close that day. I asked about a two to New Milford, CT, where Max has another location, and was about 70 miles away; I was told that my policy didn't cover that much distance, but if I wanted to pay for such a tow, it would be $800-something. I don't them to forget I even called.
I called the New Milford shop, and was told that they could send a van -- I would pay for this, of course, but it turned out to be only an $80 charge -- two days hence.
Luckily, I had called my wife earlier -- I was 122 miles from home -- and around that time she appeared in our car.
Also around that time, a NY State Trooper had arrived at the rest stop. I asked him if I could leave the bike parked there for two days; he told me that he didn't mind, but someone would undoubtedly notice and complain, and have my bike towed somewhere ... probably in a day, and certainly before two days were up. He said that he could get a flatbed tow truck there in five minutes, did I want him to do that? I told him yes, and in about three minutes a truck came. I rode the bike up on the truck, and he went to his shop, about three miles away (cutting through a median bypass), and my wife drove me home.
Two days later, the van from Max in New Milford came, and took the bike.
I was notified a couple of days ago that the tires have been replaced. They pointed out that the front tire tread depth was fairly low, so I said, sure, replace both of them.
But I also stressed that I wanted the old rear tire to be carefully examined, even if it was automatically destined for tire heaven, because I wanted to make sure that there was no problem with the rim, or the bead, or something.
According the invoice I was emailed a couple of days ago: "rear tire has gash that is causing air to leak." So that's that.
My wife and I will be driving down (about two and a half hours) next week, and I'll ride the bike home. Hopefully uneventfully.
Now, here's what puzzled me: what were the odds that I'd pick up a nail or otherwise render the tire unusable as I was entering the rest area?
I mean, I had been riding the bike all day, just fine, at high speed on the superslabs, and it felt just fine. I had last stopped about an hour before, at a no-frills, no service, pull-off on I-78 in NJ, for a stretch and a Gatorade. And then happily motored on, briskly, changing lanes, etc. Here's that stint, front that break until my stop for gas:
(That dip at about the 20-minute mark is when I was transitioning from I-78 east to I-287 north.)
So that puzzled me, the part about stopping for gas and developing a problem with the tire at the same time.
That is, until doing some searching here and elsewhere I read this nine-year-old post in the 650 forum here:
www.bmw-scooters.com
Here's the relevant part, if you don't want to read that first post:
I looked more closely and noticed the RDC warning and the rear tire at 00 PSI.
At first, I thought sensor error, as I could not feel any difference in the way the Beemer handled. I slowed a bit to 60 MPH and still could not feel anything, I thought best to pull over to check it out, rode into the shoulder and still could not feel anything. At roughly 15 MPH, the rear end started to wobble hard until I came to a full stop breaking slowly.
Sure enough, the tire was totally flat. I saw the puncture on the tire.
It looks like the same thing happened to me (minus the TPMS part). That is, it looks as if the bike will roll along merrily with minimal or no air in the rear tire ... at a good clip. Slow down, however, and it's a different story.
This was also the case three weeks earlier, before getting my first replacement tire, when I lost only about half the air in that tire. That is, at that time (as well as this latest incident), I was motoring right along, and felt that the bike was handling perfectly fine.
If you've read that other thread by now, let's not get hung up on centripital vs. centrifigal, that sort of semantics. The point seems to be that a rapidly spinning rear tire seems to keep its shape, and its ability to support the bike, okay, while a not-so-rapidly spinning rear tire does not.
And maybe this is more pronounced with scooters than with bikes with larger rear tires, because if a scooter is moving right along, those small rear tires are really moving out. Get it, moving out?
In any event, that's my theory.
And this, it seems to me, is a further indictment of BMW for not including -- either as standard or optional equipment -- a TPMS system. This fellow in Thailand has apparently done it -- see www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPRKdYBbxl4 and
-- but, as Max points out on all of their receipts: "3RD PARTY SOFTWARE IF EVER INSTALLED WILL BE DETECTED. YOUR WARRANTY WILL BE VOIDED."
Ah, I'm certainly digressing now, if I hadn't been before.
Before these two rapid-fire incidents, I don't recall ever having a flat in 27 years of owning street bikes. If I have, I've apparently successfully repressed that episode. But I do carry a 12V pump and both mushroom and string patch stuff. A lot of good that did me, huh?
That's my story.
That was an eight-day trip in the end of May, beginning of June. I had originally planned that for about two weeks earlier, but the day before I was going to leave I discovered that the rear tire pressure was about 15psi too low. I hadn't ridden the C 400 GT in about two weeks (I was goofing off on my other bike, a Meteor 350), and just sort of hoped, deluded myself, etc., into thinking this might be a fluke. Or maybe a very tiny leak -- say, 1psi per day -- and I could certainly deal with that.
So, the rear tire aired up, I started out the next morning. I got about 100 miles from home, and decided to get gas and check the rear pressure. It was down to around 20psi or so. I forget the exact pressure, but in any case I was certainly not dealing with a loss of 1psi per day. I realized that despite any wishful thinking, this was not acceptable, so I pumped up the tire, got off the NY Thruway, turned around, and headed for home on lesser roads. I stopped a couple of times to top off the air, as I was losing air at about the same rate.
A few days later, after making an appointment at Max BMW in Troy, NY -- they squeezed me in, because I sort of begged them -- I pumped up the rear tire a bunch and then some, rode the bike to Troy, and got a new rear tire installed. I didn't ask them to check the old tire, because I wasn't really interested in it, and neither were they: the service dept. rep told me that they don't patch tires, they just put new ones on (a typical liability stance, the same one taken by my car dealership, for that matter).
That was on May 22. On May 28, I head south again.
I kept a careful eye on the rear pressure, in case there was a problem with the rim or something. Such checking was easy, because I have a FOBO TPMS sensor back there. (I also have a digital gauge with me, because those asshat engineers at BMW, with their sideways "spoke" placement of the Schrader valves preclude the use of an external TPMS sensor on the front wheel, as it would smack into a brake-disc caliper; the rear, with only one disc, is okay. And don't get me started on the C 400 Grand Tourer's lack of a built-in TPMS, unlike most -- all? -- of the other Beemers.)
I checked that rear pressure each morning, and it was perfect, no change. This was after doing roughtly 500 miles the first day, 400 the next -- I was then in Asheville -- and 400 the next (doing the twisties down there). And then, after three days of real visiting, roughly 400 miles the first day on the way home, and getting as far as about 300 miles on the second and final day home. Perfect every morning. I have the screen grabs of the FOBO readout to prove it. And each time I also checked that the sensor was on there nice and tight: no movement at all.
That second day on the return trip should've been roughly 400 miles, but that was not to be. At 300 miles that day, As I was pulling into a rest area on the NY Thruway (this time headed north, obviously) to get gas, I thought the bike felt a little funny, in the handling department.
I also thought maybe I was imagining things. In any case, I got my gas, and slowly rode past the pumps, along a bit of the way toward the on-ramp. But those few yards convinced me that the bike was definitely squirrelly. So I turned around, parked, and checked the pressure ... which was 0.
So I put the bike on the centerstand, sat down on the ground -- it was 87°F, by the way -- and slowly and carefully rotated the tire. I was looking for a nail, that sort of thing, but didn't find anything. I tried to pump up the tire, but didn't get anywhere: it wasn't holding air.
So I called BMW Roadside Assistance (which is included during the warranty period). I didn't get anywhere with them, either: after a little more than two hours of phone and text communication, they said that I was on my own, make my own arrangements, they couldn't provide assistance at my location, and I would be reimbursed. That's an on-going story, and I just filed my claim paperwork a few days ago (and haven't heard back yet).
After that, I called AMA, for which I also pay for assistance, based on my auto-renewing. They could get me a tow to a multi-line, non-BMW, motorcycle shop in Mahwah, NJ -- not all that far away -- but not before it would close that day. I asked about a two to New Milford, CT, where Max has another location, and was about 70 miles away; I was told that my policy didn't cover that much distance, but if I wanted to pay for such a tow, it would be $800-something. I don't them to forget I even called.
I called the New Milford shop, and was told that they could send a van -- I would pay for this, of course, but it turned out to be only an $80 charge -- two days hence.
Luckily, I had called my wife earlier -- I was 122 miles from home -- and around that time she appeared in our car.
Also around that time, a NY State Trooper had arrived at the rest stop. I asked him if I could leave the bike parked there for two days; he told me that he didn't mind, but someone would undoubtedly notice and complain, and have my bike towed somewhere ... probably in a day, and certainly before two days were up. He said that he could get a flatbed tow truck there in five minutes, did I want him to do that? I told him yes, and in about three minutes a truck came. I rode the bike up on the truck, and he went to his shop, about three miles away (cutting through a median bypass), and my wife drove me home.
Two days later, the van from Max in New Milford came, and took the bike.
I was notified a couple of days ago that the tires have been replaced. They pointed out that the front tire tread depth was fairly low, so I said, sure, replace both of them.
But I also stressed that I wanted the old rear tire to be carefully examined, even if it was automatically destined for tire heaven, because I wanted to make sure that there was no problem with the rim, or the bead, or something.
According the invoice I was emailed a couple of days ago: "rear tire has gash that is causing air to leak." So that's that.
My wife and I will be driving down (about two and a half hours) next week, and I'll ride the bike home. Hopefully uneventfully.
Now, here's what puzzled me: what were the odds that I'd pick up a nail or otherwise render the tire unusable as I was entering the rest area?
I mean, I had been riding the bike all day, just fine, at high speed on the superslabs, and it felt just fine. I had last stopped about an hour before, at a no-frills, no service, pull-off on I-78 in NJ, for a stretch and a Gatorade. And then happily motored on, briskly, changing lanes, etc. Here's that stint, front that break until my stop for gas:
(That dip at about the 20-minute mark is when I was transitioning from I-78 east to I-287 north.)
So that puzzled me, the part about stopping for gas and developing a problem with the tire at the same time.
That is, until doing some searching here and elsewhere I read this nine-year-old post in the 650 forum here:
Punctured Tire Traveling at 75 mph - BEEMER RDC WARNING
Hey All, I just wanted to share what happened to me on my way home from 200 mile ride in Southeastern San Deigo County. The ride was awesome...! On my way home, roughly 20 miles away from home, I was riding on the interstate highway 15 cruising along with traffic (75MPH) enjoying the ride...
Here's the relevant part, if you don't want to read that first post:
I looked more closely and noticed the RDC warning and the rear tire at 00 PSI.
At first, I thought sensor error, as I could not feel any difference in the way the Beemer handled. I slowed a bit to 60 MPH and still could not feel anything, I thought best to pull over to check it out, rode into the shoulder and still could not feel anything. At roughly 15 MPH, the rear end started to wobble hard until I came to a full stop breaking slowly.
Sure enough, the tire was totally flat. I saw the puncture on the tire.
It looks like the same thing happened to me (minus the TPMS part). That is, it looks as if the bike will roll along merrily with minimal or no air in the rear tire ... at a good clip. Slow down, however, and it's a different story.
This was also the case three weeks earlier, before getting my first replacement tire, when I lost only about half the air in that tire. That is, at that time (as well as this latest incident), I was motoring right along, and felt that the bike was handling perfectly fine.
If you've read that other thread by now, let's not get hung up on centripital vs. centrifigal, that sort of semantics. The point seems to be that a rapidly spinning rear tire seems to keep its shape, and its ability to support the bike, okay, while a not-so-rapidly spinning rear tire does not.
And maybe this is more pronounced with scooters than with bikes with larger rear tires, because if a scooter is moving right along, those small rear tires are really moving out. Get it, moving out?
In any event, that's my theory.
And this, it seems to me, is a further indictment of BMW for not including -- either as standard or optional equipment -- a TPMS system. This fellow in Thailand has apparently done it -- see www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPRKdYBbxl4 and
Ah, I'm certainly digressing now, if I hadn't been before.
Before these two rapid-fire incidents, I don't recall ever having a flat in 27 years of owning street bikes. If I have, I've apparently successfully repressed that episode. But I do carry a 12V pump and both mushroom and string patch stuff. A lot of good that did me, huh?
That's my story.
